Diesel Oil for a 300TDi

Message

ANDYD · #1 Post by **ANDYD** » Wed Aug 31, 2011 12:28 pm

Hi Guys,
I did a search and was suprised that i couldn't find any discussion here on Diesel oil recomendations.
What is everyone using in their 200/300 TDi's in Canada?

I have been told that 15W-40 is the best all round weight for the Vancouver climate...any thoughts on that?

Also, anyone using synthetic? pro's & con's?

Thanks, Andy

John · #2 Post by **John** » Wed Aug 31, 2011 1:36 pm

Used Quaker State HDX 15W40 for years but it is no longer available so I would now use Shell Rotella T 15W40.

rayhyland · #3 Post by **rayhyland** » Wed Aug 31, 2011 3:56 pm

I am using Mobil 1's 0W40.

Gives good protection at higher temps, and is thin enough at low temps that it protects the turbo very quickly at startup.

It's not marketed primarily as a diesel oil, but is rated for it.

I spent a couple of hours in the R&D facility for ExxonMobil talking with their lubrican engineers, about the different oils, additives, my engine and how/where I drive my truck. This is what they decided was the best option for me.

Bill E. · #4 Post by **Bill E.** » Wed Aug 31, 2011 3:57 pm

Ditto John's comment for me Andy, the Rotella 15w40 is the most available locally so for that reason alone it is my choice. All of the dreaded Lordco outlets carry it.

By the way isn't it time to change that avatar of yours? :dormy: :doublecab:

ANDYD · #5 Post by **ANDYD** » Wed Aug 31, 2011 6:41 pm

Thanks for the comments gents, keep them coming...what else is getting used out there....?

I actually had a container of Shell Rotella in hand at Can Tire a few days ago and then put it back thinking that was too easy!

No comments on Synthetic? Probably just leak out faster eh!....

Cheers, Andy

PS Yes Bill, new avatar coming soon, i have to wait for the Canol raft to come back so I can pose on it like the last avatar... :roll:

franko · #6 Post by **franko** » Wed Aug 31, 2011 9:17 pm

I would say ALWAYS use Synthethic in a diesel. Thats all i use in my Jetta tdi last longer between oil changs. Grew up with lots of diesels on the farm and thats all we use.
But each to there own.

davran · #7 Post by **davran** » Wed Aug 31, 2011 9:41 pm

Agreed Franko. In my vw golf tdi I've used only 5w40 full synthetic european formula, vw, vmw, mercedes certified oil (penzoil and castrol made this, probably others). I change it at 10K intervals. It's at 300K and going strong.

I've been using the same oil in the D2. I will look into that 0w40 mobil-1.

Dave_F · #8 Post by **Dave_F** » Wed Aug 31, 2011 10:07 pm

I use 15w40 shell rotella in my 300tdi.

...or castol 15w40...change up every 5000k

rayhyland · #9 Post by **rayhyland** » Wed Aug 31, 2011 10:52 pm

Um, that Mobil 1 that I was talking about is fully synthetic.

Hello? Is this thing on?

davran · #10 Post by **davran** » Thu Sep 01, 2011 7:33 am

Ray (mister-grumpy-face),

I'm assuming the comments about synthetics are in reference to the Rotella T, as I don't think all Rotella-t oils are synthetic. Mobil-1 oils are all synthetic as far as I know; is that correct?

Another question. Are synthetics recommended in old series engines?

DaveB · #11 Post by **DaveB** » Thu Sep 01, 2011 7:45 am

davran wrote:Ray (mister-grumpy-face),
Another question. Are synthetics recommended in old series engines?

I would be careful of both synthetics and diesel oils in old series engines. Also I'd be careful with high detergent diesel engines in a gasoline V8 as well.

In my experience, you'll not only experience more leaking than usual, but the high level of detergents in diesel oil (used to handle the soot levels that a diesel generates) will rinse everything out of a gas engine to the point where the rings don't seal compression or oil anymore and your truck will likely start smoking. Might work fine for a short period, but likely not good to use diesel oil in a gasoline engine for long term use.

My .02 worth.

Dave

davran · #12 Post by **davran** » Thu Sep 01, 2011 8:03 am

Dave, thanks for that.

Union 76 has a old-car specific oil (76 Custom Motor Oil 40w). I was in touch with the company, and they said it's an old-style CD/SF oil which does not conform to modern standards, and has all the old additives in. I'll probably be using this in the 88.

Also, I've heard really good things about the non-API versions of Royal Purple oils. The article I read states that not having to adhere to the API standards means Royal Purple can put more ZDDP and other such additives in which are a must have for older, especially flat-tappet engines. Turns out that ZDDP clogs catalytic converters, so it's been mandated out of modern-spec. oils, which kills older engines.

Maybe neither-here-nor-there, but there you have it.

http://www.conocophillipslubricants.com ... Lubricants

http://www.royalpurple.com/motor-oil-hps.html

rayhyland · #13 Post by **rayhyland** » Thu Sep 01, 2011 8:06 am

Ha, not grumpy, that was my poor attempt at humour.

I would run synthetics in any engine, but Dave is right, make sure the lubricant you choose is approved for the gas or diesel engine you are putting it into, don't go swapping back and forth willy nilly.

In the old days, synthetics caused engines to leak because they were not compatible with the seals. Today, unless you are running a series 1 with the original 40-50 year old seals, this is not a problem.

The detergents in the additive packs are in mineral, blend, and full synthetic oils these days. But Dave is correct that the additive pack for a dedicated diesel lube will be different than the additive pack in a gas lube.

So, if the additive packs are in all engines (anti-oxidants, zinc, etc), then what makes synthetic oils different? Simply put, all the molecules in the base stock are exactly the same size and shape. So they rub together nicely. They resist breaking up when squeezed together.

Mineral oil is natural, so the molecules in the base stock are all slightly different. When squeezed or subjected to extreme sheer forces etc the molecules more easily get broken up into pieces.

This is a simplistic explanation, but I hope it make sense. I can explain it better when I have my powerpoint slides with me.

:-)

Ray

rayhyland · #14 Post by **rayhyland** » Thu Sep 01, 2011 8:08 am

Ah, I found a picture

http://www.maxxtorque.com/dieselcommuni ... iction.jpg

PaulC · #15 Post by **PaulC** » Thu Sep 01, 2011 5:38 pm

LOL very scientific Ray :lol: I rather like it!

red90 · #16 Post by **red90** » Thu Sep 01, 2011 7:08 pm

rayhyland wrote:I am using Mobil 1's 0W40.

That oil is for gasoline engines.

Make sure you are using a diesel specific oil as they are designed to probably deal with the soot.

A good quality 15W-40 is fine for Vancouver in reality and the difference in oil analysis for warm climates is not huge.

Easily available quality synthetics.
Mobil Delvac 1, 5W-40
Mobil 1, Turbo Diesel Truck, 5W-40 (Best price at Walmart)
Shell Rotella T6, 5W-40 (Watch for sales at Crappy Tire)
Shell Rotella T5, 0W-40 (This is a semi-synthetic but the oil analysis put it in the same ballpark as the others and is better if doing very cold starts).

Regardless of what you use, I would suggest oil analysis once in awhile. It tells you if the oil is working in your engine and can show up many other problems that are not normally obvious.

rayhyland · #17 Post by **rayhyland** » Thu Sep 01, 2011 8:05 pm

Thanks Red90, although marketed primarily as a petrol-engine lube in North America, the Mobil 1 0W40 is approved for diesel engines, and is the oil that Bill Maxwell says is the best of all the Mobil 1 oils for me to run in my 200tdi.

Since he invented it, I figured I would go with his recommendation.

red90 · #18 Post by **red90** » Fri Sep 02, 2011 7:20 am

rayhyland wrote:Thanks Red90, although marketed primarily as a petrol-engine lube in North America, the Mobil 1 0W40 is approved for diesel engines, and is the oil that Bill Maxwell says is the best of all the Mobil 1 oils for me to run in my 200tdi.

Since he invented it, I figured I would go with his recommendation.

Umm, OK. It only has an API CF rating. If it was "good" in a diesel it would have a higher rating. If it could pass the higher rating tests, they would give it that.

The additive package is all wrong. Why would you purposely get the "wrong" oil? Delvac 1 is Mobil's premier diesel oil and designed to be as good as it can for a diesel engine.

What are your wear numbers using the 0W-40?

davran · #19 Post by **davran** » Fri Sep 02, 2011 8:22 am

Red90,

If I undersand correctly, the "newest" standards are more to deal with Goverment regulation than what's best for our engines. For example, the newest API regulations deal with fuel economy rather than lubrication; this is why a CD/SF oil had more of the old additives in it than are allowed in modern oils.

This is why companies like Royal Purple have API and non-API oils.

I'm no engineer, but I've done a fair bit of reading about this. Please correct me if I'm mistaken.

rayhyland · #20 Post by **rayhyland** » Fri Sep 02, 2011 10:03 am

red90 wrote:
What are your wear numbers using the 0W-40?

I have no idea. I was the marketing guy for ExxonMobil, I am not an engineer. I just go with what the guys in the lab tell me to do.

I know Delvac 1 is also an excellent choice and I do use it sometimes in the summer. But I can't get it locally in 0 weight. And since I live like a hermit on a snowy mountain-top with no block-heater, that is important to me.

:)

discojonny · #21 Post by **discojonny** » Fri Sep 02, 2011 12:27 pm

Andy are you still there? just go to crappy tire and buy rotella. they have regular or synthetic and a few different weights. it is that easy and it works fine. not recommended for your swiss watch but fine for the 300. If you post pics of yours I'll show you mine.

ANDYD · #22 Post by **ANDYD** » Fri Sep 02, 2011 4:34 pm

Hi,
Yep, I did pick up some Rotella, mainly because its quick and easily available. Thanks for the feedback from everyone.

It's a bit like tires, everyone has their preferences and lots of pros & cons.

Jonathon, I will be down at Fossil Beach on Sunday / Monday, you should bring your new 110 down for a play....

Cheers, Andy

red90 · #23 Post by **red90** » Sat Sep 03, 2011 6:09 pm

davran wrote:Red90,

If I undersand correctly, the "newest" standards are more to deal with Goverment regulation than what's best for our engines. For example, the newest API regulations deal with fuel economy rather than lubrication; this is why a CD/SF oil had more of the old additives in it than are allowed in modern oils.

This is why companies like Royal Purple have API and non-API oils.

I'm no engineer, but I've done a fair bit of reading about this. Please correct me if I'm mistaken.

The answer is sort of. The difference between CI-4 and CJ-4 is mostly to due with protecting particulate filters. This has required a reduction in Sulfur, which is where some concerns on wear additives come from.

BUT the difference between CF and CG-4. CH-4 and CI-4 with respect to wear protection is quite large. CF is quite old. The reduction in wear metals from oil analysis is quite evident when running a CI-4 versus a CF.

red90 · #24 Post by **red90** » Sat Sep 03, 2011 6:13 pm

rayhyland wrote:I have no idea. I was the marketing guy for ExxonMobil, I am not an engineer. I just go with what the guys in the lab tell me to do.

I know Delvac 1 is also an excellent choice and I do use it sometimes in the summer. But I can't get it locally in 0 weight. And since I live like a hermit on a snowy mountain-top with no block-heater, that is important to me.

:)

Are you cold starting below -20 C? You could always use the Shell 0W-40.

Can you still contact these guys? It would be nice to hear a technical explanation of why the Mobil 1 is preferred to the Delvac 1. It really does not make sense.

You should really get a Webasto. It is the one best modification I have ever put into my truck. With a $20 wireless remote, I can turn on the heater and have a warm engine 15 minutes later anywhere, anytime.

red90 · #25 Post by **red90** » Sat Sep 03, 2011 6:16 pm

For some price shopping...

Mobil 1 TDT, 5W-40: $37 for 5 liters at Walmart

Shella Rotella in either 5W-40 or 0W-40 at Crappy Tire, $40 for 5 liters (ignore the 4.4 liters shown on the website, all current stock is 5 liter). The comes on sale a coupe of times a year. Sign up for the sales alerts.
http://www.canadiantire.ca/browse/produ ... 9h8L4zMpTk!

The Rover-Landers of BC

The Rover-Landers of BC

Diesel Oil for a 300TDi

Diesel Oil for a 300TDi

Diesel Oil

Oil for Diesel