Let's talk about frames

[The_Anachronist]

On the topic of frames, is there anything to discuss beyond the following?

1. Hit it all over with a hammer. If it doesn't bend, then blast, prime and paint it and enjoy not buying a new one.

2. If it bends, buy a shiny new galvanized frame and weep for your ruined marriage.


I know welding can bring almost anything back from the dead - my problems are:

a) I don't know how to tell if it's dead, and
b) I can't weld.

Knowing full well that this basically amounts to asking "How long is the imaginary piece of string I am thinking of?", opinions are hereby solicited.

[red90]

....then blast, prime and paint it and enjoy not buying a new one.

Galvanize, don't paint. It does not cost much (no more than paint) and is a thousand times better.

As to fixing one, you can buy replacement parts for most parts of the frame. That makes it fairly simple to get the bad parts fixed up without a lot of welding labour.

[The_Anachronist]

I understood that galvanizing was not an option for an old frame, because of the presumed rust and muck inside the box sections...?

[red90]

I understood that galvanizing was not an option for an old frame, because of the presumed rust and muck inside the box sections...?

They sand blast the outside and the inside is cleaned with an acid bath. People galvanize old frames all the time.

[The_Anachronist]

Interesting. Might save a marriage or two...

[TOLON]

The acid bath will eat the rot and could leave you with a galvanized frame full of holes so make sure you check the frame thoroughly and do all the repairs ahead of time as breathing zinc dust is not advised. The other problem is the galvanized coating fills some of the small mounting holes in the frame and they need to be reamed out.

I agree galvanizing is better but I would also give POR15 consideration.

[Rob]

I pondered the same question a few years ago with a 1966 Series 2a 109 5 door. The frame was solid, only needed a patch in the front and I replaced the rear cross-member rather than repair it as it was bent. I had the frame sandblasted, painted with a 2 part frame paint (scratch resistant) and wax-oiled the inside of it. All said and done for about $1000 (I had a shop do the work... was about 10 years ago, included check the frame dimension, painting the axles, etc). Galvanized is awesome but can be expensive and there are risks involved in warping the steel, clogged drains and it complicates future repairs or modifications due to the zinc hazard related to welding/cutting/sanding... it also takes away from the originality of the vehicle if that is important to you though you can always conceal a galvy chassis with paint). From what I know, the early 2/2a frames were better quality than the later 3 and defender frames so if yours is in good shape after 50 years, if you take care of it the frame should be good for many more. My suggestion is go the same route as I did to preserve the chassis and save your resto budget for other expensive things that are bound to crop-up.

Cheers, Rob

[DrRangelove]

poke it 'ard with a screwdriver all over - if you don't go through the metal you're probably good. Are you taking the body off the frame? The reason I ask is because the top of the rails is usually where decades of mud and crap accumulate without being washed away, causing rot. The top of the frame is less likely to be waxoyled by previous owners as it's hard to get to.

Galvanising is great. If you can afford it. You also have to get the frame to the specialist shop where it's going to be done.

I was very fortunate to pick up a project with an almost immaculate frame - very little surface rust and all the original paint on it. Once I fixed the bends and PO butchering (custom bumper welded to dumb irons) I have a really solid frame with no rust. All I did was give a good clean, light sand and going over with a wheel where required, red oxide prime followed by black rust coat. On top of that went a very generous layer of waxoyl (you can apply it with a brush, like paint) which cures to a hard but flexible waterproof coating. My Dad has owned Landys for years back in the UK and swears by black waxoly. Waxoly is as good as galvanising as long as you reapply every couple of years and make sure you get some oil inside the frame.

In my case, POR-15 was not worth the cost. POR stands for "Paint on Rust" and its the reaction with oxidised metal that provides the protection. As most of the factory paint was on my frame POR-15 would have just been very expensive black paint. Everyone's project and budget is going to be different and I know a few people who swear by POR-15 and are very happy with it.

[red90]

Galvanizing here costs around $250 for a frame. We have never seen a frame warp.

POR-15 does not react with rust. It is a high solids polyurethane paint that is moisture cured. It simply seals the surface. You are supposed to convert the rust first with phosphoric acid.

[DrRangelove]

Galvanizing here costs around $250 for a frame. We have never seen a frame warp.

Wow, that's cheap. Wish I'd have known this 18 months ago!

[mepham55]

I looked into galvanizing my chassis in Vancouver and it was around $375. And you have to dip it first which was an additional $500. I opted to just clean my frame and paint it.

Matt

[The_Anachronist]

There are a couple places in Langley for galvanizing, and tons of "car nuts" around so they are used to frames. I will do a little research and report my findings.

Thanks for the info - I will know more when I get the body off. (So far I have removed the spare tire and one lamp. :wink:

[ANDYD]

Give Silver City plating on Annacis Island a call, a few club members have had work done there and reported very positive results.

They gave us a "club tour" a few years back and were a friendly bunch.

Cheers, Andy

[The_Anachronist]

Will do!

[camo388]

I will do a little research and report my findings.

Have you found out anything to report?
I'm nearly to the stage of being able to paint or galvanize my 110 frame but still undecided which way to go.

[Bill E.]

If you've got the chassis already prepped (everything removed including wiring, brake lines, plastic clips etc.) Galvanizing is the way to go.. You won't ever regret it. Red90 may be a bit optimistic about the cost of galvanizing but whatever the difference, it's worth every penny. Paint if you must, for originality, for ease of future welding or to avoid completely removing all the stuff attached to your chassis. Nothing beats the happiness that comes with a nice thick layer of sacrificial anode :bounce:

[red90]

...Red90 may be a bit optimistic....

Bill just had a couple of frames done in Edmonton. $244 for the galvanizing.

http://alre.club/Forum/index.php?topic=223.0

...and then galvanized (with the galvanizer cleaning out the bush holes, cleaning off the shock posts, cleaning out the steering relay hole and cleaning the threaded holes in the frame) for 244 bucks.

[Bill E.]

Awesome!